231 Responses to “Birmingham Ladywood”

1. H.Hemmelig

   Yes that’s true.

   It is however quite noticable that native residents born before around 1950 seem to have a more provincial Kentish accent whereas younger people who have grown up in the area sound more Sarrff London.

   September 8th, 2010 at 3:29 pm
2. Adam

   I agree with Benjimin that there are some issues that need to be handled by a single elected body, especially transport, environment, housing and economic development.

   I don’t think a West Midlands authority should cover the whole of the West Midlands region because there are some urban areas such as Stoke on Trent and rural areas such as Herefordshire that have their own local concerns.

   I also don’t think it is wise for a WMA to take responsability for areas such as health and education because then it starts to function like a devolved government rather than a local/regional authority. This could create a conflic of interests if for example the conservatives control the WMA and their is a labour government at Westminster (or vice versa).

   Issues such as waste disposal and local planning would remain in the control of the MBC’s and unitery councils.

   This is not creating a system of wasteful regional government which has very few powers and where the lower levels of local government stay that same. There will never by more than 2 levels of local government. But it would update the boundaries and bring a number of different bodies and quangos together to make them more effcient and democratic.

   September 8th, 2010 at 4:41 pm
3. benjamin

   Given that health is one of the areas with the most regional and sub-regional quangos and there are already moves to hold some form of public elections to these bodies, it would make sense to incorporate NHS services into the remit of any devolved settlement.

   The West Midlands region as is has no legitimacy whatsoever. It would break down rather nicely into an urban West Midlands as we have been discussing and a more rural/small town Severn Valley region which, in the event of widespread regional devolution could provide the same functions for Herefordshire and rural Shropshire and Worcestershire as well as Gloucestershire currently in the sprawling South West region.

   The problems then are the North Staffs/Stoke on Trent area (clearly distinct from the West Midlands conurbation – a much more Northern feel) and the southern parts of Warwickshire which belong neither more with Oxfordshire.

   When it comes to local government, I really think we need to separate the cultural and historical value of the traditional English counties from the practical business of government today. Local and regional councils should serve areas that make sense to the people living there now and which are small enough to operate as meaningful communities. We can value old identities like Warwickshire and Staffordshire while recognising that Stratford on Avon or Stoke on Trent have no business being part of the same government structure as the urban core of Birmingham and the Black Country.

   September 8th, 2010 at 5:38 pm
4. Barnaby Marder

   I’ve picked this seat as the city centre one in Birmingham.
   This is the largest local authority seeing local elections this year (in fact in the whole UK). Here along with so much of the Midlands & the North Labour will be looking for widespread gains. Labour should be able to take the following wards won by the Tories in 2007: Weoley, Quinton, Billesley, Brandwood, Erdington, Kings Norton, Longbridge & very likely Bournville which was reasonably close last year, and Springfield, Selly Oak, Hodge Hill, Perry Barr & Moseley/Kings Heath from the LDs. If these wards are all picked up the arithmetic would be Lab 53 C 37 LD 26 Respect 3. Labour has good chances however to make further gains, all from the Tories : Bartley Green, Edgbaston, Harborne (even though Labour have only won it once as far as I know) and Northfield all require fairly modest swings from last year’s elections. A Labour gain is not impossible from Respect in Sparkbrook but would be difficult against Salma Yaqoob. Should all those further gains from the Tories take place it would leave the party still somewhat short of an overall majority. To take control this year gains will be necessary in ostensibly safe LD wards in the Yardley constituency and that won’t be at all easy. Labour has a slight chance of achieving outright control this year but will probably have to wait until next year unless an outstanding performance can be produced.

   March 29th, 2011 at 12:35 pm
5. Pete Whitehead

   I think some of your suggestions are wildly optimistic there Barnaby and I would describe Labour’s chances of taking control this year as not even slight. I agree they are most likely to do so in 2012, provided they make the requisite gains this year – I think most of those on your initial list of Tory seats will be gained, but not Bourneville and certainly not Bartley Green, Harborne etc nor will they gain Perry barr

   March 29th, 2011 at 1:45 pm
6. Shaun Bennett

   I agree with Barnaby about most of his expected Labour gains except for Edgbaston, Bournville, Harborne, and possibly Northfield and Erdington (which has been trending away from Labour recently).

   As Pete says, outright Labour control is almost impossible this year. I think it will be most interesting to see if the Lib Dems collapse in those wards they have turned into feifdoms in the 1990s and 2000s such as Yardly, Perry Barr, Hall Green, Shelton and Acocks Green.

   March 29th, 2011 at 1:51 pm
7. Barnaby Marder

   Pete you could well be right. I’m going by last year’s council election results. I am obviously aware that they weren’t typical because of the far higher turnout than usual, and Birmingham clearly sees a lot of ticket-splitting – even in last year’s elections, while Labour held Edgbaston in the general election, Conservative candidates outpolled their Labour counterparts in the wards making up that constituency. It is perhaps best to look at the 2007 results as a base therefore and I shouldn’t be too surprised if Bartley Green, Edgbaston & Harborne prove beyond my party, perhaps also Bournville, but there is quite a substantial swing out there at the moment & I’m not sure I’m wrong about all of these. It could well be one of those authorities where Labour will have to wait until 2012 for their chance to take control – that was true even in 1995, where massive gains in authorities where a third were up for election enabled Labour to take control the next year, even though the Tories did slightly less badly (eg Hertsmere), but not yet in 1995.

   March 29th, 2011 at 3:23 pm
8. Pete Whitehead

   Yes and in 1996 even if the Conservatives had done averagely well they would have lost loads of seats because they were defending those won in 1992 which in many cases were seats they would never normally expect to win. The situation will be similar in 2012 in relation to seats won in 2008 when there will inevitably be large Tory losses even without them needing to do anything like as badly as in the mid 1990s (for example in Southampton they won all but two wards in 2008 and are bound to lose many/most of them in 2012)

   March 29th, 2011 at 3:53 pm
9. Joe James B

   Overall Labour control in Birmingham would be almost impossible this year, as has been said.

   The Conservatives should, however, have something of a local advantage to hold seats in the Edgbaston constituency, for instance.

   I think Labour control is inevitable at some point though, unless we have a deviant year like 1982 to stall Labour’s advances in mid-term, which looks unlikely.

   March 31st, 2011 at 4:18 pm
10. Andrea

    It’s related to local elections but it would fit better in Perry Bar constituency thread…so I don’t know where to put it..anyway
    Labour have internal problems in Lozells and East Handsworth ward..judging by what it has been reported in the local press…Cllr Mahmood Hussain and Khalid Mahmood MP don’t get along well…..a Unite official close to Mahmood has challenged Hussain for the nomination….there has been a row about membership figures….regional party stepped in and re-selected Hussain…then a NEC panel stepped in and chose the other candidate
    After May elections, the NEC will do a full review of selection procedures in Birmingham….

    Lozells and East Handsworth is very safe. I don’t know what would happen if Hussain stands alone

    March 31st, 2011 at 6:01 pm
11. Dalek

    Why did North Birmingham swing to Labour long before South Birmingham?

    Perry Barr and Handsworth were Tory in 1970 and Labour in 1979.

    Northfield was Labour in 1970 and Tory in 1979.

    Also, the Tories held out in Selly Oak longer than in Handsworth.

    Labour also notionally gained Erdington in 1983.

    March 31st, 2011 at 8:42 pm
12. H.Hemmelig

    That analysis is simplistic and misleading.

    South East Birmingham ie. Sparkbrook and Small Heath has always been very strongly Labour.

    Northfield, Selly Oak and Edgbaston are much more middle class and have seen less immigration, at least until the last 10-20 years. The influence of the university and public sector middle class has swung Edgbaston and Selly Oak away from the Tories, factors that were not that decisive in the 1980s.

    Perry Barr and Erdington are much more working class, and at least in the case of the former there are more immigrants and they are of longer standing.

    April 1st, 2011 at 6:02 am
13. Pete Whitehead

    I don’t think that analysis is quite right. Edgbaston and Selly oak are obviously different animals, but I would not say Northfield is much more MIddle Class than Perry Barr. In terms of dicsussing the seats of Northfield and Perry Barr as they were in 1970 or 1979 they are pretty similar really. The Perry Barr seat of today has a large non-white population becuase it includes the two Handsworth wards but before 1983 it comprised only of Oscott, Perry Barr and Kingstanding and would have been almost entirely white in 1970 and 1979. There has been some kind of divergence between north Birmingham and demographiocally comparable areas in the south (ie not Edgbaston, but areas like Northfield and Kings Norton). Northfield was safely Labour in 1964 while Perry Barr was a Conservative gain against the trend that year. Clearly that result was affected by the immigration isssue, but not because of an influx of immigrants into that seat, but into neighbouring seats.
    In fact though there was this difference between the winners in 1970 and 1979 the results were still not disimilar. Both seats were won with a majority of around 1200 in 1970 and with a three figure majority in 1979. But it does appear that after 1979 there was this divergence and this was also refelcetd in local elections. IN good years in the 80s the Tories would win marginal seats in the north such as Erdington, Oscott, Hodge Hill as well as those in the south whereas latterly (with the exception of their renaissance in Erdington) have struggled in the former marginals in the north while doing better in former Labour strongholds in the south like Longbridge and Kings Norton.
    I’m not sure what the answer to Peter’s question is – some complex mixture of ethnic and class factors plus a bit of personal voting (eg for Geoff Rooker in Perry Barr), but I certainly wouldn’t dismiss the premise.

    April 1st, 2011 at 12:17 pm
14. richard

    Which wards did the Conservatives win in Birmingham in 1982 and in 1992.

    And, if possible, what were the swings per ward over the decade.

    June 8th, 2011 at 10:24 pm
15. Pete Whitehead

    In 1982 the Conservatives won 20 wards to 17 Labour and 2 for the Alliance. In 1992 the overall figures were a similar 21-15-3 but there was a fair amount of churn

    Conservative wards in 1982

    Acock’s Green
    Bournville
    Brandwood
    Edgbaston
    Erdington
    Hall Green
    Harborne
    Hodge Hill
    Moseley
    Northfield
    Oscott
    Perry Barr
    Quinton
    Sandwell
    Selly Oak
    Sheldon
    Sutton Four Oaks
    Sutton New Hall
    Sutton Vesey
    Yardley

    Labour

    Aston
    Bartley Green
    Billesley
    Fox Hollies
    Handsworth
    King’s Norton
    Kingstanding
    Longbridge
    Nechells
    Shard End
    Small Heath
    Soho
    Sparkbrook
    Sparkhill
    Stockland Green
    Washwood Heath
    Weoley

    Alliance

    Kingsbury
    Ladywood

    The changes in 1992 were
    LD ‘gain’ from Con

    Acocks Green
    Sheldon
    Yardley

    Lab ‘gain’ from Alliance

    Kingsbury
    Ladywood

    Lab ‘gain’ from Con

    Sandwell

    Con ‘gain’ from Lab

    Bartley Green
    Billesley
    Longbridge
    Shard End
    Weoley

    I shall try and work out the swings later

    June 9th, 2011 at 10:00 am
16. Pete Whitehead

    The Labour to Conservative swings between 1982 and 1992 may not be entirely as expected, though there are wards at either end of the spectrum that fit the kind of pattern one would have predicted. The problem with taking these two years is that both are highly atypical in different ways. 1982 saw a good Alliance vote spread fairly evenly but which obviously impacted on the vote shares of the main two parties. 1992 was an abnormally good Conservative result. Comparisons between more normal years might be more illuminating, though it might be hard to define ‘normal’

    In 1982 the Conservatives were 3.5% ahead of Labour in the popular vote in Birmingham. In 1992 the lead was 14.0% – so a swing over the decade of 5.3%
    By ward the swings were in descending order:

    Small Heath 20.2
    Sparkbrook 19.6
    Bartley Green 18.5
    Sparkhill 12.6
    Shard End 11.7
    Longbridge 10.6
    Oscott 10.3
    Weoley 10.2
    Billesley 9.3
    Kingstanding 8.3
    Kingsbury 6.8
    Northfield 6.0
    Harborne 5.9
    Washwood Heath 5.4

    Birmingham 5.3

    Soho 4.8
    Hodge Hill 4.5
    Stockland Green 4.3
    Sutton New Hall 3.7
    Brandwood 3.4
    Fox Hollies 3.4
    Sutton Four Oaks 2.8
    Sheldon 2.7
    Yardley 2.7
    King’s Norton 2.4
    Hall Green 1.9
    Handsworth 1.2
    Sutton Vesey 0.7
    Acock’s Green 0.3
    Aston 0.2
    Ladywood -0.5
    Edgbaston -1.0
    Bournville -1.2
    Erdington -1.2
    Quinton -1.5
    Selly Oak -2.3
    Nechells -3.3
    Sandwell -4.7
    Moseley -5.7
    Perry Barr -8.4

    June 9th, 2011 at 10:15 pm
17. richard

    Thanks Pete.

    Didn’t the Conservatives win a majority of wards in 1991 as well or am I mistaken?

    Some thoughts:

    The Northfield area was much weaker for the Conservatives in 1982 than it is now. Caused by car industry troubles perhaps?

    The Conservative position in the Selly Oak area was clearly rotting by 1992.

    Why have the Conservatives not recovered in Hodge Hill or Shard End? Yardley is understandable as the LibDems became the anti-Labour party but the Conservatives have done well recently both in the Erdington area and the adjacent Meridien wards.

    June 10th, 2011 at 7:32 pm
18. Andy JS

    I think Hodge Hill and Shard End have moved down the social scale somewhat since 1982.

    June 10th, 2011 at 10:18 pm
19. Barnaby Marder

    Re the Northfield area, it’s worth remembering that Labour gained the seat in a parliamentary by-election in 1982, albeit with a very small swing, Labour appears to have helped a fraction more than the Conservatives by the high Alliance vote. The Tory improvement in the area between 1982 and 1992 therefore wasn’t just confined to local politics.

    June 11th, 2011 at 3:12 am
20. richard

    So outside the Sutton wards the Cosnervatives won the following wards:

    1982, 1992, 2008
    Bourneville
    Brandwood
    Edgbaston
    Erdington
    Harborne
    Northfield
    Oscott
    Quinton

    1982, 1992
    Hall Green
    Hodge Hill
    Moseley
    Perry Barr
    Selly Oak

    1992, 2008
    Bartley Green
    Billesley
    Lonbridge
    Weoley

    1982
    Sandwell
    Acocks Green
    Sheldon
    Yardley

    1992
    Shard End

    2008
    Kings Norton
    Stockland Green

    So out of 24 wards they won in their three big years they only managed to win 8 of them all three times.

    An indication of how things can change in a generation.

    June 18th, 2011 at 11:16 am
21. richard

    There’s a map in the Penguin Atlas of British and Irish History of the 1971 Birmingham council wards with their then ethnic minority percentage.

    Comparing the wards boundaries it seems:

    2011 Edgbaston = 1971 Edgbaston

    2011 Harborne = 1971 Harborne

    2011 Quinton = 1971 Quinton

    2011 Bartley Green = western half of 1971 Weoley

    2011 Weoley = eastern half of 1971 Weoley + northern bit of 1971 Longbridge

    2011 Longbridge = most of 1971 Longbridge

    2011 Northfield = 1971 Northfield

    2011 Kings Norton = southern two thirds of 1971 Kings Norton

    2011 Bourneville = northern third of 1971 Kings Norton + southern third of 1971 Selly Oak

    2011 Selly Oak = northern two thirds of 1971 Selly Oak

    2011 Moseley = 1971 Moseley

    2011 Brandwood = 1971 Brandwood

    2011 Billesley = 1971 Billesely

    2011 Hall Green = eastern two thirds of 1971 Hall Green

    2011 Springfield = western third of 1971 Hall Green + eastern half of 1971 Sparkhill

    2011 Sparkbrook = western half of 1971 Spakhill + southern third of 1971 Deritend + western half of 1971 Sparkbrook

    2011 Acocks Green = 1971 Fox Hollies

    2011 S Yardley = 1971 Acocks Green + eastern half of 1971 Sparkbrook + western third of 1971 Yardley

    2011 Stechford + Yardley N = eastern two thirds of 1971 Yardley + western half of 1971 Stechford

    2011 Sheldon = 1971 Sheldon

    2011 Shard End = eastern half of 1971 Stechford + eastern half of 1971 Shard End

    2011 Hodge Hill = western half of 1971 Shard End + northern half of 1971 Washwood Heath

    2011 Washwood Heath = southern half of 1971 Washwood Heath + western half of 1971 Saltley

    2011 Bordesley Green = 1971 Small Heath + eastern half of 1971 Saltley

    2011 Nechells = northern two thirds of 1971 Deritend + 1971 Duddeston

    2011 Ladywood = 1971 Ladywood + eastern half of 1971 Rotton Park

    2011 Soho = western half of 1971 Rotton Park + 1971 All Saints + western half of 1971 Soho

    2011 Aston = 1971 Aston + 1971 Newtown

    2011 Lozells and Handsworth East = eastern half of 1971 Soho + western two thirds of 1971 Handsworth

    2011 Handsworth Wood = 1971 Sandwell

    2011 Perry Barr = 1971 Perry Barr + eastern third of 1971 Handsworth

    2011 Oscott = 1971 Oscott

    2011 Kingstanding = 1971 Kingstanding

    2011 Stockland Green = western half of 1971 Stockland Green + western half of 1971 Gravelly Hill

    2011 Erdington = eastern half of 1971 Stockland Green + western third of 1971 Erdington

    2011 Tyburn = eastern two thirds of 1971 Erdington + eastern half of 1971 Gravelly Hill

    December 3rd, 2011 at 10:34 am
22. Harry Porter

    Which constituencies have included the area covered by Ladywood and Aston wards?

    April 25th, 2012 at 11:39 am
23. Pete Whitehead

    Its a little bit complicated, due to ward boundary changes. I will attempt a full answer later, if somebody else hasn’t already done so.

    April 25th, 2012 at 12:34 pm
24. Harry Porter

    Well for starters there was a Birmingham Central constituency from 1885 to 1918, I would guess that most of that area presumably including the Cathedral was in there, but the seat’s Wikipedia entry does not give its boundaries nor which seats its territory was transferred to on its abolition, which is helpful The bordering constituencies were East, Edgbaston, North, and South.

    April 25th, 2012 at 6:11 pm
25. Pete Whitehead

    The reason I say its complicated is because in the past there were many more wards covering the areas covered by those two wards now. For example there was a Market Hall ward covering much of the city centre and which is in the east of the current Ladywood ward. That area was in Birmingham central from 1885-1918 but was then part of Edgbaston from 1918 until 1974. It has been part of Ladywood since then. To the west of the current Ladywood ward is Rotton Park. This area was in Edgbaston 1885-1918, Ladywood 1918-55, All Saints 1955-74 and Ladywood again since 1974. Ladywood itself has of course always been in the constituency called Ladywood (since 1918) before which it was part of Birmingham Central.

    Aston was also divided. Before 1982 there were two wards covering the area roughly covered by Aston now – Aston and Newtown. Aston itself was in Handsworth from 1974 to 1983 while Newtown was in Small Heath. The unified Aston ward was all included in Small Heath in 1983 and moved to Ladywood in 1997.
    Going back before 1974, Aston was ofcourse part of its own seat (going back to Aston Manor 1885-1918). The area covered by New Town was previousy coverd by St Pauls ward (and going even further back St Marys ward). St Pauls was part of Birmingham West 1885-1950, Aston 1950-55 and Ladywood 1955-74. St Marys was part of Birmingham North from 1885-1918 after which it followd the same course as St Pauls

    April 28th, 2012 at 4:58 pm
26. Pete Whitehead

    I should have said trhat Rotton Park was divided between Edgbaston and Birmingham West from 1885-1918

    April 28th, 2012 at 4:59 pm
27. Harry Porter

    Many thanks for your helpful and detailed answer, Pete, much appreciated!

    May 4th, 2012 at 7:17 pm
28. Harry Porter

    John Bright, of ‘the angel of death’ fame, was the MP for Birmingham Central from the seat’s creation in 1885 until his death in 1889; his son John Albert Bright won the by-election.

    May 4th, 2012 at 7:23 pm
29. richard

    Pete

    Didn’t the Conservatives win a majority of the Birmingham wards in 1987?

    If so which ones?

    May 8th, 2012 at 10:42 pm
30. Pete Whitehead

    Yes they won 22 of 39 wards. These were: The three Sutton wards, all 11 wards covering the then constituencies of Edgbaston, Northfield and Selly Oak, plus Brandwood, Billesley, Acocks Green, Sheldon, Hodge Hill, Erdington, Oscott and Perry Barr. The SDP won Hall Green and the LIberals won Yardley with the remaining 15 wards being won by Labour.
    The Conservatives also won 12 of 20 wards in Wolverhampton that year with Labour winning in just 5

    May 8th, 2012 at 11:57 pm
31. Andy JS

    “Second city, second class: Birmingham, Britain’s largest city outside London, is falling behind. It is a case study in the effects of over-centralisation and poor management”:

    ht tp://www.economist.com/blogs/blighty/2012/11/birmingham-0

    February 14th, 2013 at 6:09 pm