The weekly YouGov poll for the Sunday Times is up here. Voting intentions are CON 32%, LAB 36%, LDEM 7%, UKIP 16%. The 16% for UKIP is the highest YouGov have shown them at for three months, just after the European elections. It’s likely that the publicity over Douglas Carswell’s defection may have helped this, but remember YouGov have updated their methodology since then which has also boosted UKIP by a point. A defection is pretty quickly forgotten though, the real kicker from the Carswell defection is the by-election that comes with it, if UKIP win that by anything like last night’s Survation poll suggests expect a much more concrete impact on the polls.

YouGov also asked again about Western intervention in Iraq. Support for humanitarian intervention (77% support) and American air strikes against ISIS (56% support) are broadly unchanged. Support for RAF participation in air strikes is 43%, down 2 points since a week ago. It’s not a significant change, but it suggests the steady growth in support for British airstrikes that YouGov had been recording has now halted. People are slightly less supportive of extending air strikes against ISIS into Syria – 45% would support US airstrikes in Syria (24% opposed), 37% would support British airstrikes in Syria (37% opposed).

86% of people think that British citizens going to fight for Islamist forces pose a threat when they return here, and 79% think British citizens fighting for ISIS has increased the risk of terrorist attack on Britain.

Turning to the situation in Rotherham, 75% of people think that Shaun Wright, the South Yorkshire Police Commissioner, should resign from his post. 74% think any other people in senior roles in Rotherham council or police at the time of the child sexual exploitation scandal should also resign. More generally YouGov asked if people thought that when an organisation commits serious errors the people at the top should resign anyway, or should they only resign if they are personally at fault. It was an even split – 42% thought an organisations leaders should resign in the case of serious error even if they were not personally to blame, 43% that they should only go if they were personally to blame.


361 Responses to “YouGov/Sunday Times – CON 32, LAB 36, LD 7, UKIP 16”

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  1. @ Colin

    The problem is that whether you think the Cameron stance on Europe is sensible and consistent or not, he (and the Labour party) are not addressing arguably the only reason that masses of people don’t like the EU or want to leave which is immigration. I doubt that the other issues of employment legislation, health and safety legislation, EU subsidies etc really rank that high in voters concerns.

    The immigration figures last week (which could also be another reason for a UKIP bounce if there is one) pretty much tell you that the pledges on immigration have failed. Immigration dropped during the recession and has picked up with more jobs available. Only EU exit or renegotiation on freedom of movement (which no one seems optimistic about and Cameron hasn’t set as a target for renegotiation) deals with the issue of those who want immigration halted.

    So I tend to agree with Crossbat that from a political point of view Cameron had no chance of satisfying that section of the electorate and might have been better keeping to the swivel eyed loon line and more widely praising the benefits of EU membership winning the argument. Of course he was boxed in because of the Tory right so arguably has played a bad hand as well as it could be played.

  2. @GuyMonde

    Yes you are right, that statement of his is hyperbole, perhaps Mr B would like to qualify that sentence

    I was more thinking of his second paragraph

  3. Bill Patrick

    I think the figure of speech I used is called “syllepsis” – but it’s a long time since I knew the names of these devices.

  4. OLD NAT:
    Afternoon Sir.
    Year 37, term 109 about to commence.
    It will be an historic term, I think. Mr R.Burns will cheer from his spot in heaven in September.

  5. @Colin – “His position has not changed from that which he set out clearly in the 2013 Bloomberg speech.”

    Yes, but that is only a year ago. He’s been in power for four and a half years.

    True or not, the perception amongst his Euro sceptics is that he has let them down, repeatedly promising them something (cast iron pledges spring to mind?) and then letting them down.

    Carswell jumped now, as he said that it has become clear over this summer from Cameron’s own advisers, that his sights on reform are set very low, and are intended to convey an impression of reform, rather than anything near as substantial as eurosceptics want. And now Cameron is preparing to say he could campaign to leave the EU. They know he is intent on keeping the UK in, whatever happens. The only thing up for grabs is which excuse he will use for this.

    There is no question that Cameron’s emphasis has changed, if not his actual policies, but I don’t believe my argument is nonsense. Cameron has repeatedly stated he believes the UK is better off in the EU, yet is making noises that we could leave. He is satisfying no one, but making the idea of leaving more acceptable and mainstream by his toying with it.

  6. FV

    This one
    h ttp://w ww.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/aug/30/rotherham-girls-could-have-been-spared-ann-cryer

  7. Will go through the rest of the thread later, but on the topic of the TV debates, let me ask this rhetorical question (and please, leave it as an unanswered question, because while the question is intended to provoke early thought on what effect TV debates might have on polling, the answers would invariably lead to political squabbling).

    In whose interest, if any, would it be to stop the debates, if it were possible to scupper the negotiations without being blamed for their failure?

  8. SHEVII

    I was contesting Alec’s comment that “By avoiding a direct, head on challenge, Cameron has repeatedly strengthened UKIP, and diminished his own credibility.”

    My view is that it is BECAUSE he has directly challenged NF’s view that leaving is the only solution to our perceived ills, in Bloomberg & after he has strengthened UKIP.
    Obviously-because those who do not believe that he will get any concessions on Free Movement will move to UKIP.

    Whether DC turns out to be correct is another matter-one which increasingly looks like something we will never find out.

    DC needs to find a way of communicating things like this :-

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11059343/Angela-Merkel-announces-plans-to-deport-EU-welfare-cheats.html

    But I don’t think the Kippers are listening anyway.

  9. @ChrisHornet
    Well I am definitely going to disobey and answer David Cameron.

    Clegg is beyond help, but a debate would probably harm him so a (haha) hypothetical gain for the LDs too.

  10. As was said at [the NewsUK] meeting earlier this week there can be no doubt that [they] have two kitchen sinks to throw. It’s going to be a tough and bitter fight.

    As for debates [they] will argue as I’m sure DC will that it should be between him and EM ; the only two possible Prime Ministers.

  11. ALEC

    @” Cameron has repeatedly stated he believes the UK is better off in the EU, yet is making noises that we could leave. He is satisfying no one, but making the idea of leaving more acceptable and mainstream by his toying with it.”

    If you are trying to impress on EU colleagues and the Brussels Bureaucracy that UK is serious about the changes it wants-that the voters of UK think immigration from EU is too high & this has high salience in their voting intentions-that a party committed to leaving UK is waiting in the wings to hoover up votes in this country-what else would you say ?

    He is not going to play EM for you-we already have that one:- The EU needs reform; we must engage positively, make friends, blah blah” If that’s what you want you can vote for it already.

  12. @Colin

    Thank you

    @Toonie

    I see you post on the yougov website, i wonder if you would ask Jabdi if he would contribute to the discussion here. His statistical work is really interesting

    Here is [b] Jabdi’s [/b] results for yougov in August

    The results for August YouGov polls:

    CON: 33.7% (+0.05)
    LAB: 37.1% (-0.21)
    LIBDEM: 7.9% (-0.32)
    UKIP: 12.6% (+0.33)

    LAB LEAD: 3.3% (-0.27)

  13. @ Crossbat11,

    I agree. I think the debates could go either way- both Miliband and Cameron are capable but inconsistent debaters, and I’d say the odds of victory for either are about fifty-fifty.

    Given that, it’s a gamble for both of them, and therefore, the debates favour whoever is behind and needs a game-changer to get his party over the line.

    What Cameron doesn’t seem to understand is that currently, this person is him.

    He has a problem, because he has to agree to the debates well in advance and he can’t know whether or not the Tories will begin to pick up by next May. But given the huge swing he needs from the current polling just to be largest party, much less win a majority, and the speed at which the Labour lead is declining (ie. by 2% every spring), it seems insanely overconfident to assume the Tories will be poised for victory by then, especially in light of Clacton.

    I think he’s just convinced himself Miliband is not The Right Sort, and so somehow the stars will align to prevent such statesmanlike fellow as himself being sacked and replaced by that chancer. Which is not how elections work, as Churchill or Mitt Romney might tell him, but long may he continue to believe it.

  14. Carfrew,

    The original hypothetical was a Lib-Lab coalition.

    I’m not sure about Labour and the unions in 1979. Thatcher felt obliged to cave into the unions after the Winter of Discontent by accepted a wage explosion in the public sector, but would Labour have been able to use their bargaining power over the trade unionists (“It’s us or the Tories!”) to secure wage moderation, at least until later in the parliament? Though perhaps getting the wage explosion and the subsequent rise in unemployment early would be politically easier…

    I think that one can make a general claim that ever election after 1959 and before 1983 was a good election to lose!

  15. Feeling uncomfortable about the tag” Jehovah’s Witnesses” , which swayed my opinion on poor Ashya King.

    I now read that NHS cannot provide the treatment his parents want, and give the young boy only months to live.

    Aren’t these parents entitled to fight for their child’s life?

  16. @Colin
    I think you’ve got a point there. Kippers (and many of those in the “smoked” end of the Tory party) just don’t believe DC is seriously interested in curbing immigration – which is their big issue. The referendum offer just looks like a trick to them (and is, IMO).

    This reduces the possible gain from getting smokier. I think that DC knows this and has written that hardcore off, hoping to gain in the centre through economic growth. I can’t see how he can change course now without a massive loss of credibility. The plan either works or it doesn’t.

  17. POSTAGE

    @” I can’t see how he can change course now without a massive loss of credibility. The plan either works or it doesn’t.”

    I agree.

    That’s it-for good or ill.

  18. @Bill P

    I think it’s possible Labour had used up their bargaining power with the unions by the time of the Winter of Discontent. They had been pressing down on wages to curb inflation after the first oil spike, the unions had gone along with it to some extent, had seen inflation fall from 25% in ’75 to 8% in ’78… then another price spike and bout of inflation meant repeating the wage medicine was more than the unions could or would accept.

    Labour tried it anyway, and it didn’t persuade them… and the unions knew the rationale by then, having gone along with it to some extent in the first place. But there is also the problem of members being fed up of seeing wages eroded by steepling inflation, whatever union leaders may have thought.

    Labour never really saw the extent of the problem. You need more ammo to deal with things like external shocks and price rises on essentials, ammo that helps without causing further problems…

  19. Carfrew,

    I think the problem was that Labour were willing to walk down the right road, but now see it through. Theoretically, pretty much every macroeconomist would now agree that (a) incomes policies can be a useful complement to monetary/fiscal policy as part of a disinflationary strategy, but (b) they are a bad substitute for monetary/fiscal discipline. In practice, the Labour experience was typically unsuccessful experience with incomes policies: after an initial period when policy was well-coordinated (1976-1977) they dropped interest rates to a very low level due to exchange rate concerns in late 1977. In fact, at times in 1977, bank rate was 5% while RPI inflation was over 14%.

    Still, might Labour have had a better time getting a good deal out of the unions? As you say, it’s possible that they’d lost what bargaining power they had, but then again a Labour government with a majority might have been able to implement statutory punishments (and perhaps general controls) as they attempted against Ford in 1978.

  20. I am not a Kipper, although I, as a Tory see certain attractions in SOME of their ideas.

    I begin to think now, that only a Tory-UKIP deal will prevent Mr Miliband from forming a government next May. I believe, and I am not big on predictions, that could such a deal be worked out, Mr Miliband would then be as far from election success as Cameron is now. I am aware that the Tories are only 3 points behind today, but I foresee the UKIP trolley bus making all the stops along the way.

  21. @Colin

    Here is Youtube video by the father of Ashya King.

    h ttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14ETQn9ZPwk

    I think the hospital and police have some questions to answer. This case looks some what different to the perception given by the initial media attention when hear the father’s side.

  22. Catmanjeff (fpt)

    Assuming Douglas wins, that surely makes the argument that Nigel Farage should be included in the TV debates (if they happen) stronger

    But in that situation it will also become difficult to exclude the Greens (which maybe what you are hoping for :D) on the grounds that they also have an elected MP assuming their poll ratings are still around the same level as the Lib Dems. A jump from 3 to 5 or 4 to 6 is going to be difficult for the broadcasters and I suspect there will be resistance from them – particularly if the coalition parties are a bit skittish about having the debates at all.

    I actually wasn’t thinking about the Greens (my default position is that I assume the media and establishment will leave them out, even if including them is merited).

    I think that both the Greens and UKIP, if given more coverage, would make gains from the main two. The main parties know this, and therefore a TV debate not set up to given Lab and Con an advantage would not be welcomed.

    The two party state we live in has looked rocky for sometime, and a UKIP by-election win anything like the Survation poll suggests would be a hammer blow to this cosy relationship.

  23. Catmanjeff and Colin.
    If I may, Colin will recall perhaps, that Mrs H and I have been through this and that which the parents have yet to face. Right from the first report, we had a strong suspicion that Hants police were acting perhaps from ignorance. When we heard the parents had been arrested (and unbelievably incarcerated we understand?) we have been very upset. The parents, as I write above, have a horrific time ahead of them and it is all very cruel.

    I don’t normally comment in this way, but I hope none here ever have to be confronted with this dreadful event, as the little boy and his parents now are and will be.

  24. @Howard

    I’m sorry you have had to face such times – it’s must be an incomprehensible nightmare.

    Not on the same scale, but we are challenging our LEA over certain issues with our children and ‘professional’ assessments. We have encountered some professionals who don’t like the fact we have challenged them. We raised concerns about certain processes they followed their conclusions, and we have seen reports (looking over our GPs shoulder) that label us as people who are difficult and got abusive with them.

    We didn’t – simply disagreed firmly with them for objective and justifiable reasons (backed by evidence from world experts).

    Some professionals do not like to be challenged, or deal with people who do not automatically fall at their feet and bow down to their supposed superior knowledge.

    Mr King is intelligent, articulate and just wants his son to have the best chance of life. I wish him and his family the very best.

  25. @Colin – I appreciate your point, but I’m talking more about how Cameron is/has been perceived by voters. Most of them don’t read speeches like you do.

    He was very keen to appear to be anti EU, and hasn’t gone out of his way to praise the benefits of membership. On balance, I would suggest most voters would think that he has been trying to present himself as something of an anti, rather than a pro.

    I agree it is a really difficult balancing act to pull off, but he clearly hasn’t managed it. One critical problem has been his failure to capitalise on potential alliances within the EU – he has managed to lose trust and credibility pretty much on all sides.

    The calculation regarding the referendum was wrong, and galvanised the anti EU backbenchers to mobilise and start organising, and they have pushed him ever since. Now they know he can’t deliver, the game is up.

    I did say at the time that the in/out pledge was a strategic error, while others said it was the game changer that would win the Tories the GE. I’m tending towards self satisfying smuggery at the moment.

  26. Correction

    @Howard

    I’m sorry you have had to face such times – it’s must be an incomprehensible nightmare.

    Not on the same scale, but we are challenging our LEA over certain issues with our children and ‘professional’ assessments. We have encountered some professionals who don’t like the fact we have challenged them. We raised concerns about certain processes they followed and their subsequent conclusions, and we have seen reports (looking over our GPs shoulder) that label us as people who are difficult and who got abusive with them.

    We didn’t – simply disagreed firmly with them for objective and justifiable reasons (backed by evidence from world experts).

    Some professionals do not like to be challenged, or deal with people who do not automatically fall at their feet and bow down to their supposed superior knowledge.

    Mr King is intelligent, articulate and just wants his son to have the best chance of life. I wish him and his family the very best.

  27. CATMANJEFF
    I agree

  28. ALEC

    @”I agree it is a really difficult balancing act to pull off”

    Probably impossible-but at least he is trying.

    I have no time for the mealy mouthed ” EU reform?-yeah, we should -lets talk it through-make allies- not upset anyone though-and never ever say we might leave”

    @”The calculation regarding the referendum was wrong, and galvanised the anti EU backbenchers to mobilise and start organising, and they have pushed him ever since. Now they know he can’t deliver, the game is up.”

    I know DC can do no right for you-but you really excell in the above.

    If he had mouthed Europhile platitudes & refused any idea of a referendum you would have criticised him .
    If he had agreed with NF that reform is impossible & threatened to leave you would have criticised him.

    Con backbenchers who are firmly against membership of EU were never going to be satisfied with anything short of a NF style approach.

    It is UKIP’s success in the Euro Election which has screwed DC. The rabidly antis think their time has come .

  29. Floating Voter
    Thanks for that info about August averages. It is quite clear to me that we are very much in the same situation that was reached in the latter 90s, where the voters, collectively, are just waiting to change the government, without any further fuss.

    The UKIP frolics, just as the SDP ones back in the early 80s, could only ensure a greater outright majority for Labour, as things stand. I imagine that Farage will be concerned that too much enthusiasm from fanatical supporters does not put off the floating voters.

    Catmanjeff and Colin
    Thanks for replies.

  30. One point did n’t the parents of the little boy with brain tumour go off with a piece of hospital equipment i.e.. the feed mechanism? They are still using the NHS then?

    Another point, it was pressman( his last post but one I think), who said that would be national anger which could not be underestimated if Labour were elected when more than 50 percent of voters voted for right wing parties. A couple of posters praised pressman’s post. However nobody made the obvious comment, perhaps because it was so obvious, However, I shall make this obvious comment now.

    At the last general election left wing parties gained more than 50 percent of the vote. Just adding Labour and Lib Dems 29 plus 23 gives 52 percent, without adding any other parties. Look what government we ended up with. Where is the national anger that cannot be under-estimated? It is the electoral system.

  31. @ Colin,

    The treatment which Mr King wants his son to have is controversial. Here’s an opinion provided by Consultant neurosurgeon Andras Kemeny.

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/349115/250m-NHS-vanity-project-but-2m-could-save-more

    He’s basically saying that there are other treatments which work just as well, or even better, than the treatment which Mr King would like his son to have. His opinion was given in 2012, so he is not commenting in response to the current controversy.

  32. @Adge3

    However nobody made the obvious comment, perhaps because it was so obvious, However, I shall make this obvious comment now.

    Many posters would agree with you, but choose not to respond.

  33. SHEVII says … ”Only EU exit or renegotiation on freedom of movement (which no one seems optimistic about and Cameron hasn’t set as a target for renegotiation) deals with the issue of those who want immigration halted.”

    But this is wrong.
    Norway is not in the EU but is a member of the EU single market. As such it obeys EU single market rules which include free movement of Labour. (remember that right wing nutter who murdered hundreds in protest) It also pays money into the EU’s regional funds. Its a big net contributor to the EU.
    UKIP make big deal out of some ‘free trade’ deal but of course they are vague about what that would be.
    To be out of the EU but in the single market would involve free movement of labour. To be out of the EU full stop would have serious consequences for our inward investment and many jobs – like the car industry for starters.
    UKIP airily wave their hands and say it will be all right on the night. This is what I call ‘The Salmond Approach’ to sanely managing your economy.
    I for one do not believe it.

    So being out of the EU but sanely in the EEA like Norway would in reality make no difference – except having no influence in the EU.
    Norway like all EU countries is part of Schengen. We got an opt out. Now tell me – if we just walk out and then try to strike a deal – anyone think we would not have to join Schengen? Lets be real – its a big sledgehammer of a leaver for the EU to use against us.

  34. AMBER

    Thanks.

    I don’t suppose it is of any comfort to Mr King to be told that Proton Beam is not cost effective in UK.

    Perhaps this in an awful reminder that the NHS has finite resources.

    I would like to know if the Kings requested Proton Beam treatment outside UK at NHS expense, and if so what the response & rationale for response was.

    Thoughts with the young boy.

  35. @ADGE3
    But the LibDem 23% saw their party in government.

  36. “when an organisation commits serious errors the people at the top should resign anyway, or should they only resign if they are personally at fault.”
    The people at the top are supposed to know what is going on. They are therefore personally at fault.

  37. @Adge @Catmanjeff

    – not only is it the electoral system, it’s the electoral system the Conservatives fought to keep!

  38. On the sub line of this update – polling relating indirectly to the Rotherham situation – it’s not always a black-and-white issue to attribute blame.

    I think back to the phone hacking saga, where it took years for the authorities to determine who at the top did and did not have direct involvement, and the debate on the extent to which an individual organisation’s culture or the industry’s culture as a whole contributed to the situation prompted the PM to set up a very high profile judge-led enquiry which also took forever.

    To an extent it’s relevant to the Wright case too.

    My personal view is that his position is untenable due to how low confidence in SYP has been for the last four or five years (and therefore how much confidence the public need to have in that specific force’s PCC), coupled with the sheer scale of the social service failings.

    But other than the scale of the child sex abuse (which despite the absence of a figure was widely believed to have been more than a few tragic cases), most of the other relevant information was a matter of record and/or common knowledge by late 2012, and so the implication of the poll above is that consensus has shifted since 2012 on the extent of Wright’s responsibility as the councillor overseeing that department.

  39. @dave You say ” But the Lib Dem 23% saw their party in government”.

    In reply to you is what Tony Blair said. He said that the Lib Dems fought the 2010 election on a manifesto well to the left of Labour and ended up serving in a government well to the right of Labour.

    Of course I do not say which policies are good or bad if any. The question is – did the voters vote for that?

  40. Bored. Where is the new Scotland polls.

  41. Skippy

    Should that have been “Where is the new Scotland polis”?

  42. @Skippy

    That us what I am wondering 1 poll in 2 weeks and we know polls have been done. Panelbase(2) YouGov(2) Ipsos Mori might be for debate on Tursday Populous. But none have been published.

    Does anyone know when we might get a new poll?

  43. Couper2802

    Anthony does – but won’t tell. Spoilsport.

  44. OLD NAT.
    Good Evening to you. Is it your sense that things are going the YES (we can) way?

    I thought Darling and Brown were not convincing recently.

  45. @”I thought Darling and Brown were not convincing recently.”

    Both poor choices .

    Brown-dour & uninspiring-where’s the surprise?

    Darling-chosen to forensically take AS’ little porkies apart, and give us the facts. Failed because AS talked over him & he let it happen.

    Where is the Happy, Optimistic, Positive spokesman for BT laughing at the separatists & asking-what on earth do you want to do that for when you’ve got all this?

    If YES win it will be because AS smiles -and NO didn’t.

    :-)

  46. Chris Lane

    As you’ll know, I’ve always been a pessimist about our chances of winning – polling being the main source of reasonably impartial evidence, makes that position sensible.

    However, since you are asking about my “sense” of how things are going, things seem to have changed more rapidly in the last week or so,

    Obviously, my observations aren’t objective evidence, and I’m not pretending that they are any more than that.

    What appears to be an increasingly shrill aspect from the No camp (I don’t expect No voters to agree with that interpretation!) may suggest some panic on their side. The articles in today’s Scottish edition of the Sunday Times were interesting, as they suggested an aspect of internal bickering on the things that have gone wrong. In my experience of observing political campaigns, that’s usually a bad sign. I saw the same in the SNP in the 80s and Labour in 2007 and 2011.

    The sense of fun about the campaign is also intriguing. In addition to the massively greater proportion of Yes than No signs in windows, gardens and trees, we’re also seeing people putting up signs in their window reading “Probably”.

    Does that mean I think we’ll win? No, but probably closer than I’d thought. Objectively, I’ll watch the polls.

  47. COLIN

    I agree both are poor choices so why don’t we put Cameron up on the podium? I mean the guy has plenty to say on the subject and he is the British Prime minster.

  48. Colin

    In many ways, your observation is the same as mine! :-)

  49. @ Billy Bob (from a few threads ago)

    “Good to hear from you, and glad you weren’t offended by my jocularity. We don’t generally spend our evenings invoking you, but hey, Jim Murphy was in distress.”

    Never offended. It was kinda funny how the timing worked out.

    “Sounds like you’re getting plenty of campaigning expirience these days. Btw, you aren’t by any chance working on a Ramsaela MacDonald themed cupcake? Can’t think of an election that has turned upon such a thing, but in your world it’s a possibility.”

    Lol, too much campaign experience. It’s not that I want to do and thankfully I’m not really working on a campaign right now. I’ve gotten to that point in my life where I’m too old to work on campaigns. And I need to focus on building up my business. But I’m still helping this campaign out some because I care very deeply about the candidate and want to see him win for a variety of reasons.

    The Ramsay MacDonald cupcake would never lose an election but it could lose you a competition on television.

    @ Old Nat (from a few threads ago)

    “Nice to see you back (or “your back” if you wore a backless dress to the pageant!).”

    No, one supporter (a CDP Delegate who I whipped very hard to vote for him) described us as looking like we were at a “Brooks Brothers event.” You’d like this woman. I’ll tell you why. At the July post-primary endorsement caucus for the California Democratic Party to endorse in this race, she was the ONLY Delegate who at the caucus, waited to hear speeches from both candidates, filled out a blank ballot, and then got up and cast her ballot after there was a call for ballots. Everyone else had already voted and so the speeches were meaningless otherwise. The room was small, packed, hot, and extremely tense. But Delegates began clapping and chanting her name and it broke some of the tension. I

    “Thanks for the link. Nothing new, but quite a succinct summary,
    In return, you may be interested in a Yes supporter’s description of Jim Murphy’s meeting in Stonehaven.
    http://raymcrobbie.com/2014/08/27/return-of-the-britnats/
    He (and I) agree with you about the “wackos”.”

    Interesting blog post. To me, there’s nothing that outrageous about Cybernat activities or statements. You guys are just voicing your opinions.

    @ Martyn (from a few threads ago)

    “Dude, welcome back! All we need now is the return of Eoin & Virgilio and it’ll be just like 2011…:-)”

    Lol. Thanks. Well I can’t spend too much time on here but it’s nice to pop in every once in a while. Should be an interesting election next month.

  50. Chris Lane

    In the context of political discourse, and the emotional language used, I found this tweet from the British Labour Party interesting.

    “The Labour Party
    Don’t just talk about how much you hate the Tories. Volunteer with us and do something about it”.

    I’m not sure that people find parties that use words like “hate” very attractive.

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