Comments on: Would an AV referendum on election day save Labour?

By: Colin MK2

Colin MK2 — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 15:23:48 +0000

While debating the possible outcome of the next election on this board I am still puzzled a to what would be the best system for a better representation of the electorates wishes.
The FPTP has problems the PR has problems the AV ha problems the boundaries set in favour of Labour.
Maybe something approaching the Swiss style system with more referendums on major changes or the USA where you can force a referendum with enough signatures.
Not that any of this will ever happen in GB, too many vested interests. It can not be right to have landslides with 25% of the total votes, have unelected Lords in the government. Not good for democracy may be that is why nearly half the people can’t be bothered to vote. As friend of mine said to me “ I don’t vote, it only encourages them”

By: Andy Stidwill

Andy Stidwill — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 14:11:42 +0000

Michael Thrasher is taken to task by Political Betting:

http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2009/11/14/is-michael-thrasher-right-about-a-hung-parliament/

By: king harold

king harold — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 12:30:47 +0000

@Frederic Stansfield
A great many people will agree with your last paragraph. The previous actions of these people leaves no room for doubt about their self interest.

By: COLIN

COLIN — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 12:14:30 +0000

@ MIKE R :-

“The election should simply be about manifesto;”

@ FREDERIC :-

” It will be a shambles.”

In two nutshells.

Any government with 12 years of administration behind it seeking a referendum on the last possible day ,when it is also
seeking re-election would have no legitimacy for that referendum.

It would deserve to pay the price -win or lose-of the resulting shambles which Frederic rightly predicts.

By: Frederic Stansfield

Frederic Stansfield — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 11:57:29 +0000

If, as is very widely predicted, the election is on May 6th. 2010 in many places there will also be District Council elections, with all the complications that involves. And now various Labour people and “The Guradian” are suggesting a referendum too. It will be a shambles.

Election campaigns typically concentrate on one topic. In 2010 it will be the economy. Unless a referendum is held separately, it will not represent the considered judgement of the people.

I have posted it before, but I cannot do so too often. ONLY ONE ELECTON ON A SINGLE DAY.

I am in favour of PR providing it is between individual candidates, not parties, in multimember constituencies. Otherwise, traditional first past the post. There is no best system (Arrow’s impossibility theorem shows this), so we should have something simple to vote at (it doesn’t matter if the counting is complicated) and transparently fair. As all the different systems Labour have inflicted on London, Scotland, Euroelections etc show, this is the one thing the self-interested cynics in Labour will not give us. In particular, they keep on at lists.

The expenses scandal, and the recent conviction of a folrmer UKIP MEP elected on a lists system, highlights how important it is that voters can vote for or against individual candidates. NO LISTS.

Of course, the overwhelming question will be: Why didn’t they propose it in 1997? Plenty of Labour people favoured PR before 1997: I did when I belonged to Labour in the 1980s.

Frankly, if Labour propose a referendum on PR now I will almost automatically vote against change on the assumption that what the Government is doing is simply for self-interest. And I think very many other people will think the same.