Weed isnt an issue of right and left

It is to an fair extent.

Well nowadays it seems like the argument is moving on from “should this be made legal?” to “how heavily should the market be regulated when it is?” (And inevitably, “could this be nationalised?”) And those are classic left-right issues.

Tim Jones: I’m really struggling to see how people in general, and the young in particular, are becoming more libertarian. If they are they’ve got a funny way of showing it – or maybe we just have radically different ideas of what “libertarian” means. Your contention that “young people as a whole don’t see it as a job for the government to make an individual’s life better” is broad to the point of meaninglessness – do you really think that we wander past homeless people and think to ourselves “nothing the state can do about this”?

“If my rather socially right wing Father is backing regulated Cannabis sales then I think it appears inevitable that it will be introduced by 2030.”

IMO it isn’t inevitable. In the foreseeable future I can’t see any government other than a Corbynite one fully legalising cannabis, and in order to do so a Corbyn government would need a bigger majority than he’s ever likely to get.

As you get older and have children your attitude to legalising drugs tends to harden, especially in the rougher parts of the country where the misery drug addiction causes is plain for all to see. Yes legalisation might reduce burglaries etc but I can’t see it doing anything to reduce usage, common sense suggests quite the reverse.

For the life on me I can’t see why the chattering classes are intent on banishing smoking tobacco whilst at the same time liberalising smoking cannabis…healthwise the latter is much worse.

Left and right are economic positions. Weed is not an economic debate.

What would be nationalised? Weed shops?

Matt: legalisation is not an economic debate. But, once legalised, cannabis forms a market, and surely government oversight of that market *is* an economic issue.

Hemmy: perhaps you’re right that public opinion is less pro-drugs than I thought. I think I’m falling victim to my own filter bubble here. The opinion columns I read are really a mixture of left-liberals and right-liberals, and often that provides balance but on an issue like this it probably doesn’t. Oh God, I’m going to have to start reading Peter Hitchens…

Leaving that to one side, we’re now not far away from smoking being banned in a much wider definition of public space than was originally envisaged, and also anywhere near children (including in private cars and private houses).

Unless legalised cannabis is going to drive a coach and horses through all that I don’t see where people will be legally allowed to smoke it.

On the harder drugs I see no prospect of cocaine, heroin etc being legalised for a long time yet.

until then though the debate continues to be one of whether you think the state should convict people for growing weed or not

I could at some time see a right wing government legalizing Cannabis if global travel has moved that way.

I wouldn’t be surprised

It wouldn’t be until 2030 or so but at the very earliest.

Caroline flint becomes the first Labour Mp to confirm she will be voting for the Deal. In her article she names Lisa Nandy, Gloria De Piero and Gareth Snell as having the same understanding of small towns as she does. Through Snell was critical of the deal yesterday and De Piero is a shadow Minster so not overly certian they going to back the deal.
Don’t be surprised if they are calls for her to lose the whip over this.

~While Lisa Nandy is on twitter backing Caroline Flint’s idea, through prehaps being a bit more open to Parliament amending the withdrawal agreement.

This small towns rehtoric I hear Nandy mention every 10 minutes really lack substance. It’s a shame her politics are enough she doesnt need focus group buzzwords

It looks like Caroline flint sees No deal as better than second referendum.

Backing a 2nd ref would go down badly in don valley

So would a no deal which she clarified n a latter tweet (it showed the downside of one tweet as not enough words to get the point fully across).But with Lisa Nandy announcing her opposition to the deal it is hard to see there being enough Labour rebels to cancel out even the DUP.

I imagine this is the kind of place where ‘no deal is better than a bad deal goes down well’

It does- through of course this also an area where immigration is probably the only aspect of the deal which many people care about. Fishing and Northern Ireland Backstops are probably not key voter issues here.

The thing is, as it becomes clearer by the day that the government is going to lose this vote, the incentive for Labour backbenchers to rebel is severely reduced. Facing the opprobrium of both wings of the Labour Party, with attendant whip disciplining, deselection threats etc, might be a price worth paying for the sake of avoiding a no-deal disaster, but it’s clear that a handful of Caroline Flints voting with May isn’t going to make a blind bit of difference, and therefore there would be no policy reward to compensate the personal sacrifice that would be incurred.

Also, the withdrawal agreement isn’t popular with leavers or remainers. It’s unpopular most everywhere, and I doubt the Don Valley is an exception to that.

I think for Flint it will be that at least a no deal and effects it has on her constituents was not on my conscience – an ‘I tried my best to protect you’ attitude.

I think Polltroll is quite right. There really is no incentive for Labour MPs to vote with May on this…unless they happen to particularly adore the withdrawal bill as it stands, which strikes me as kind of unlikely. The hardcore Eurosceptics in the Tory party won’t back her, the DUP won’t and forget about the SNP. The numbers patently don’t add up.

Theresa May might lose by such a majority that it’s hard to justify bringing this agreement back to the commons again at a later date

Debates and special Question Time’s I suspect biggest effect will be it make even less likely May could convincingly govern if her deal was rejected.

I suspect this view from Bridget Phillipson (Sunderland South) might be pretty typical of those Corbyn-sceptic Labour MPs in northern seats:

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2018/11/theresa-may-wants-my-support-brexit-deal-heres-how-she-can-get-it

Like every other faction, they are moving away from backing the deal.

Caroline Flint has confirmed she would back no deal over revoke.
This is why a no deal will happen – there are enough Labour mp’s to make the number of Tory mp’s needed to stop it unimaginable high number.